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Puzzles, Games and Name That Car => Solved AutoPuzzles => 2010 => Topic started by: guido66 on October 02, 2010, 05:18:01 AM

Title: GG-226 Victoria by "Groninger Motorrijtuigenfabriek"
Post by: guido66 on October 02, 2010, 05:18:01 AM
Tell me what this is, and I'll reward you with a point  :)
Title: Re: GG-226
Post by: guido66 on October 06, 2010, 04:37:57 PM
Experts?
Title: Re: GG-226
Post by: ftg3plus4 on October 07, 2010, 08:17:51 AM
I'd say it's a Lutzmann vis-a-vis, about 1896.
Title: Re: GG-226
Post by: guido66 on October 07, 2010, 01:09:29 PM
It's not a Lutzmann. I only have an estimated year for this and your not far off.
Title: Re: GG-226
Post by: ftg3plus4 on October 07, 2010, 09:27:37 PM
Early Opel (c.1898) based on the Lutzmann?
Title: Re: GG-226
Post by: guido66 on October 08, 2010, 03:30:02 AM
Not an Opel, either
Title: Re: GG-226
Post by: guido66 on October 14, 2010, 04:55:50 PM
1 up
Title: Re: GG-226
Post by: pnegyesi on October 14, 2010, 11:05:00 PM
Is it from Germany?
Title: Re: GG-226
Post by: guido66 on October 15, 2010, 05:35:32 AM
No
Title: Re: GG-226
Post by: pnegyesi on October 15, 2010, 07:33:05 AM
Is this from Northern Europe?
Title: Re: GG-226
Post by: guido66 on October 15, 2010, 10:25:03 AM
No
Title: Re: GG-226
Post by: yves on October 16, 2010, 02:07:52 PM
From Southern Europe ? ;)
Title: Re: GG-226
Post by: guido66 on October 16, 2010, 03:24:43 PM
Not from there
Title: Re: GG-226
Post by: pnegyesi on October 16, 2010, 11:43:38 PM
Russia?
Title: Re: GG-226
Post by: grobmotorix on October 17, 2010, 03:49:08 AM
Bent engined? It looks very much like a kind of licence build of a Benz Victoria.
Title: Re: GG-226
Post by: guido66 on October 17, 2010, 03:52:13 AM
Not from Russia, and I have no information on the engine
Title: Re: GG-226
Post by: pnegyesi on October 17, 2010, 05:40:55 AM
Is it from Europe at all?
Title: Re: GG-226
Post by: Tom_I on October 17, 2010, 06:50:45 AM
This is one of several puzzles that I am finding very frustrating at the moment, as I can get half-way to an answer, but no further.

This car looks just like an 1895 Lutzmann - there's a well-known photo below. The two cars are the same in almost every detail. The only significant difference I can see is in the rear hub, where the Lutzmann has a large drum, which would have external contracting brakes acting on it, while the puzzle car appears to just have a sprocket wheel for the chain drive, but no brake drum.

So is it a Lutzmann built under licence by someone else, or a blatant copy of one, or maybe a genuine Lutzmann that has been modified mechanically? Whatever it is, I haven't been able to find it.

But as a guess, is it from the USA?
Title: Re: GG-226
Post by: guido66 on October 17, 2010, 01:13:52 PM
Not from the USA. There is very little known about this make, so I cannot tell you anything about a Lutzmann relation.
Title: Re: GG-226
Post by: pnegyesi on November 04, 2010, 04:29:28 AM
Is it from Europe at all?
Title: Re: GG-226
Post by: Allan L on November 04, 2010, 04:58:07 AM
I agree with ftg3plus4 and Tom_I that if it is not a Lutzmann, there is too much about it that is the same for there to be no connection.
Quite possibly it is a publicity photo used for the non-Lutzmann make when they had yet to build a car, so they used a Lutzmann photo.
Perhaps Guido66 can post another photo of the car so that we can see how different (or not) is it.
Title: Re: GG-226
Post by: DeAutogids on November 04, 2010, 09:28:17 AM
Is it from Asia?
Title: Re: GG-226
Post by: guido66 on November 04, 2010, 10:17:09 AM
It is European and it's the only photo of this vehicle known to me
Title: Re: GG-226
Post by: DeAutogids on November 04, 2010, 10:20:17 AM
Benelux?
Title: Re: GG-226
Post by: guido66 on November 04, 2010, 02:05:00 PM
Yes, indeed.
Title: Re: GG-226
Post by: DeAutogids on November 04, 2010, 02:12:54 PM
I would almost think it is "Groninger Motorrijtuigenfabriek" then? (of which it is said it was based on Lutzmann)
Title: Re: GG-226
Post by: guido66 on November 04, 2010, 02:47:34 PM
 :hail:

Title: Re: GG-226 Victoria by "Groninger Motorrijtuigenfabriek"
Post by: Allan L on November 04, 2010, 03:33:11 PM
I wouldn't think they sold many in 1900! The design was well out of date by then, and as was said it's an 1895 Lutzmann in every detail -  a lot of development took place in five years in those days.
Title: Re: GG-226
Post by: DeAutogids on November 04, 2010, 03:35:08 PM
Quote from: guido66 on October 17, 2010, 01:13:52 PM
Not from the USA. There is very little known about this make, so I cannot tell you anything about a Lutzmann relation.
The make is mentioned in the famous book about cars from this country.
I have some info posted too.

The make is very known. It is the car that carried the license plate with the number "1" on it.
Title: Re: GG-226 Victoria by "Groninger Motorrijtuigenfabriek"
Post by: guido66 on November 04, 2010, 03:45:53 PM
There is a certain site out there on Dutch car history, I'm sure you know which one I mean.

It only states that this make existed in 1898 and 1899, and that 2 cars were shown on the 1899 Amsterdam show. Nothing else known it says.  ;)

So, the make perhaps is well known, but facts about it are very scarce  :)
Title: Re: GG-226
Post by: Tom_I on November 04, 2010, 03:53:06 PM
Quote from: DeAutogids on November 04, 2010, 03:35:08 PM
The make is very known. It is the car that carried the license plate with the number "1" on it.

I can't find a bigger picture, but if you mean this one, it's not the same car. This one has a front axle, but the puzzle car has each front wheel mounted in a bicycle-type fork.
Title: Re: GG-226
Post by: DeAutogids on November 04, 2010, 04:28:59 PM
Quote from: Tom_I on November 04, 2010, 03:53:06 PM
Quote from: DeAutogids on November 04, 2010, 03:35:08 PM
The make is very known. It is the car that carried the license plate with the number "1" on it.

I can't find a bigger picture, but if you mean this one, it's not the same car. This one has a front axle, but the puzzle car has each front wheel mounted in a bicycle-type fork.
Don't forget that this manufacturer made more then one car.
Title: Re: GG-226 Victoria by "Groninger Motorrijtuigenfabriek"
Post by: DeAutogids on November 04, 2010, 04:30:06 PM
Quote from: guido66 on November 04, 2010, 03:45:53 PM
There is a certain site out there on Dutch car history, I'm sure you know which one I mean.

It only states that this make existed in 1898 and 1899, and that 2 cars were shown on the 1899 Amsterdam show. Nothing else known it says.  ;)

So, the make perhaps is well known, but facts about it are very scarce  :)

My nickname is a site as well.
There is the book of Lammerse.
Title: Re: GG-226 Victoria by "Groninger Motorrijtuigenfabriek"
Post by: guido66 on November 04, 2010, 04:49:26 PM
I also have a photo of number two.  :D
Title: Re: GG-226 Victoria by "Groninger Motorrijtuigenfabriek"
Post by: DeAutogids on November 04, 2010, 05:22:25 PM
Pretty conclusive
Title: Re: GG-226 Victoria by "Groninger Motorrijtuigenfabriek"
Post by: Tom_I on November 04, 2010, 05:50:18 PM
But that's not the puzzle car either - it's quite different.
Title: Re: GG-226 Victoria by "Groninger Motorrijtuigenfabriek"
Post by: DeAutogids on November 04, 2010, 05:52:05 PM
Quote from: Tom_I on November 04, 2010, 05:50:18 PM
But that's not the puzzle car either - it's quite different.
Absolutely.
Groninger has never made 2 cars alike; all of them (less then 10, I know of 5) were unique.