What is this, when was it built and what can you tell me about its motive power - for 1 point:
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Experts?
I would call it a Morris but that grill is something else.
Quote from: Tackitt on May 04, 2012, 05:23:14 AM
I would call it a Morris but that grill is something else.
You're right - a Morris base it is.
Powered by a Perkins diesel perchance?
steam?
I found the car but I haven't found any information on it yet.
Quote from: Tackitt on May 08, 2012, 03:29:16 AM
steam?
It's not steam-powered!
Quote from: Tackitt on May 08, 2012, 03:49:58 AM
I found the car but I haven't found any information on it yet.
OK, there isn't a lot of info available - just give me what you have.
If not a diesel, maybe someone build a bigger engine in it (hence the bigger nosesection)?
Is this locked? Now that my DSL line has been resurrected, I can start making wild guesses. ;D
Quote from: Delorean on May 08, 2012, 08:56:25 AM
If not a diesel, maybe someone build a bigger engine in it (hence the bigger nosesection)?
Yes, a bigger engine than standard.
Quote from: RayTheRat on May 08, 2012, 09:06:53 AM
Is this locked? Now that my DSL line has been resurrected, I can start making wild guesses. ;D
No, I didn't lock it.
Anyone can give me what they have.
Ford V8? (flathead)
Quote from: RayTheRat on May 08, 2012, 10:20:42 AM
Ford V8? (flathead)
I don't know what make the engine is; just its size and configuration.
It most likely is Ford but I can't be certain.
V8-60?
One site says that it is a 1952 Morris Special Estate Wagon. But no mention of the motor.
I have been plowing through the various Morris club websites hoping to pick up a clue.
Quote from: RayTheRat on May 08, 2012, 06:26:47 PM
V8-60?
V8 is right.
Give me the cc (or cu in if you insist!) and the point is yours?
2229 cc (136 cubic inches.)
Quote from: RayTheRat on May 09, 2012, 06:20:05 AM
2229 cc (136 cubic inches.)
Not according to my info!
It's not a flathead as far as I know.
Ok, how about a Buick (Rover, et al) 215 cubic inch (3.5L) V8?
Let's go nuts: a Corvette 5.7 Litre V8? ;D
Quote from: RayTheRat on May 09, 2012, 07:56:43 AM
Ok, how about a Buick (Rover, et al) 215 cubic inch (3.5L) V8?
No - much bigger.
Quote from: Delorean on May 09, 2012, 08:39:33 AM
Let's go nuts: a Corvette 5.7 Litre V8? ;D
Very close, but as I said before I don't know what engine it is - just the capacity, which I need exactly in cc!
5500cc?
5000cc?
Quote from: Delorean on May 09, 2012, 11:00:40 AM
5000cc?
If 5.7 litres was close and 5500cc even closer you're getting much further away with 5000cc..
Next guess: 5400cc?
5358 cc (327 cid)?
Quote from: Delorean on May 09, 2012, 11:57:51 AM
Next guess: 5400cc?
Quote from: RayTheRat on May 09, 2012, 02:03:25 PM
5358 cc (327 cid)?
Delorean's guess is much closer; we're getting back into the right area again (almost)..
5407.7 (330 CID - Oldsmobile)
5420cc 331 cu i (Cadillac)
Edging closer but still up a bit.
The site where I sourced the picture and info doesn't mention what make of engine it is but it does mention the cc - which I don't recognise as any engine I know.. So whether it's bored out, a mysterious engine or wrong I don't know.
I'll accept a 10 cc margin of error either way..
The more I try to understand this, the more confused I get. But Dodge made a 340 CID smallblock that's 5571 cc.
There were also a bunch of small Hemi motors (Dodge, DeSoto and Chrysler) that fall into that range.
5440cc?
Quote from: Delorean on May 09, 2012, 04:06:56 PM
5440cc?
Nearer...
Quote from: RayTheRat on May 09, 2012, 03:28:14 PM
The more I try to understand this, the more confused I get. But Dodge made a 340 CID smallblock that's 5571 cc.
There were also a bunch of small Hemi motors (Dodge, DeSoto and Chrysler) that fall into that range.
..but this is the closest yet! Nearly there..
In 1957 Desoto made a 345 cubic inch hemi motor. That works out to 5653.5 cubic centimeters. That's a very rare motor.
5580cc?
How about an engine of 5543cc?
Quote from: RayTheRat on May 09, 2012, 08:35:53 PM
In 1957 Desoto made a 345 cubic inch hemi motor. That works out to 5653.5 cubic centimeters. That's a very rare motor.
Too big..
Quote from: Delorean on May 10, 2012, 02:23:04 AM
5580cc?
..close but no cigar..
Quote from: Tackitt on May 10, 2012, 03:40:35 AM
How about an engine of 5543cc?
..very nearly... next guess might get you a point!
5570cc?
5550cc?
Quote from: Delorean on May 10, 2012, 05:56:20 AM
5550cc?
That's within the 10cc variation as the capacity according to my source said 5555cc!
If anyone knows what the engine is or if that capacity is correct I'd love to hear!
Here's the unmodified picture:
Here's my best guess. 5555cc is 339 cubic inches. That displacement in a Chevy smallblock motor was used by several sports car racers in the 50s and 60s, among them, Lance Reventlow's Scarab, the Echidna Special, Lister-Costin specials and a couple of Devin-bodied cars. What I've read says that the venerable 283 motor was bored and stroked to achieve that number. In order to get it, the bore was increased from 3.875 to 4 inches (that's an awful big overbore for a 283) and the crankshaft stroked from 3.00 to 3.375, an increase of 3/8". This gives a total displacement of 5558 cc. Some pretty serious bore/stroke increases for that time.
The Scarab motors were built in 1957, before the 327 was available (1962.) After '62, it would have been less of a chore to use a 1/8" stroker crank in a 327 to get that displacement size.
I've built a lot of smallblock motors, but I've always used a 350 or (my favorite) a 400 as the basis. I run a .030 overbored 400 (406 cid) in my race car. I don't think I'd want to stretch a 283 out to 339, but apparently it was done and John Staver won the 1958 SCCA B-Modified championship in the Echidna special with one of those hand grenades.
I ran across one other 5555cc motor; an Infiniti V8, but it's a much newer design and I'd be very surprised if that was the basis of the motor in the Morris. There are probably other motors that could be modified to get that number, but I didn't run across any in my search.
r
Thanks for that.
I've no idea when the conversion was done, back in the 50s or in more modern times.
Sure more info will come out about this car given lots of time..
This photo was taken a few metres from my office, as I recall studying the car quite closely when it was parked-up as a paddock support vehicle at last year's Goodwood Revival.
Quote from: Djetset on May 10, 2012, 12:18:06 PM
This photo was taken a few metres from my office, as I recall studying the car quite closely when it was parked-up as a paddock support vehicle at last year's Goodwood Revival.
Yes - I recognised the Commer Ecurie Ecosse racing car transporter in the background and figured it must have been at some prominent historic festival quite recently.
Pity you didn't get the chance to quiz its owner..
This is a bit odd. Now that the number plate is visible, I checked at DVLA, and this car is registered as a Miller, not a Morris. It's shown on one web page as "special estate wagon 1952", but the official date of registration is given as 30 January 1954.
Equally odd is that it is listed as being unlicensed since January 2000. If it is still on its wheels, then (if the DVLA information is accurate) it seems that it is being kept illegally. For those who may not be familiar with UK car licensing law, if a car is not currently licensed to be on the road (which also requires that it is insured, and has a current vehicle test certificate), then the registered keeper must make what is called a SORN (Statutory Off-Road Notification) every year, when the licence would be due. This would be shown on the DVLA website.
This car, because of its age, is exempt from Vehicle Excise Duty, but to be used on the road, it must still be tested and insured, and must display a current tax disc (which in this case would be free of charge).
But then the DVLA database is not 100% accurate..... ???
I don't see a tax disc on the windscreen.
It may be that it isn't used on the public highway but is trailered to events like the Goodwood Revival?
Is someone having us on here??
A 50s Morris with a V8 from new???
Come on fellas!!
Manuel in Oz
Quote from: Tom_I on May 10, 2012, 04:53:48 PM
This is a bit odd. Now that the number plate is visible, I checked at DVLA, and this car is registered as a Miller, not a Morris. It's shown on one web page as "special estate wagon 1952", but the official date of registration is given as 30 January 1954.
Equally odd is that it is listed as being unlicensed since January 2000. If it is still on its wheels, then (if the DVLA information is accurate) it seems that it is being kept illegally. For those who may not be familiar with UK car licensing law, if a car is not currently licensed to be on the road (which also requires that it is insured, and has a current vehicle test certificate), then the registered keeper must make what is called a SORN (Statutory Off-Road Notification) every year, when the licence would be due. This would be shown on the DVLA website.
This car, because of its age, is exempt from Vehicle Excise Duty, but to be used on the road, it must still be tested and insured, and must display a current tax disc (which in this case would be free of charge).
But then the DVLA database is not 100% accurate..... ???
Just a thought....
The only UK-based Miller I know of is the small sports car built by Jimmy Ball for the Miller Brothers in the 1940s.
I wonder if this special "Miller/Morris" is connected to them?
Quote from: Manuel on May 10, 2012, 09:44:16 PM
Is someone having us on here??
A 50s Morris with a V8 from new???
Come on fellas!!
Manuel in Oz
I don't think anyone has actually suggested that!
Seems highly unlikely, although V8s were not entirely unknown in the UK in the post-war years (Ford V8 Pilot for instance..)
I would imagine it's a much later conversion.