AutoPuzzles - The Internet's Museum of Rare Cars!
Puzzles, Games and Name That Car => Solved AutoPuzzles => 2013 => Topic started by: Wendax on November 03, 2012, 05:03:01 PM
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It's group puzzle time again. I hope this one will drive you crazy! :joker:
In the following you will see 40 closely related cars, some of which have been posted before. But some "solutions" to those puzzles were quite inaccurate. So instead of posting "I do know it better!!!" comments I decided to spend some time looking for pictures of these little beauties. Amongst them are prototypes, production cars and one-offs. All you have to do is to identify these cars correctly.
In order to prevent that some microcar buff like me grabs all points at once, you can only have a guess at one car at a time. After your post you have to wait for 24 hours before you can guess on another car.
As some of these cars are of the "It is either this or that" type, there will be no locks.
Points will be awarded after all eggs are eaten. Keep your sunny side up and have fun!
First batch:
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Second batch:
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Third batch:
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Fourth batch:
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Room for solutions:
Egg 01: Spatz by Bayrische Autowerke GmbH (BAG) (Julien1A)
Egg 02: Brütsch Rollera (pguillem)
Egg 03: Brutsch Avolette (aka Brütsch-Avolette) by Air Tourist (luisps)
Egg 04: Victoria prototype based on BAG Spatz (pnegyesi)
Egg 05: Brütsch Zwerg Einsitzer (Tom_I)
Egg 06: Brütsch Mopetta from 1956 (Facel)
Egg 07: Avolette 1956 by Air Tourist (SACO)
Egg 08: Brütsch Typ T / Eremit Cabriolet (Joao)
Egg 09: Brütsch 200 Spatz Coupé (luisps)
Egg 10: Belcar, second version with doors (luisps)
Egg 11: Brütsch Bussard (Allemano)
Egg 12: Brütsch 200 Spatz prototype (luisps)
Egg 13: Avolette 1957 by Air Tourist (barrett)
Egg 14: Brütsch R 400 (Allemano)
Egg 15: Brütsch Zwerg Zweisitzer with acrylic glass hardtop (pguillem)
Egg 16: Spatz with gullwing hardtop by Bayrische Autowerke GmbH (BAG) (pnegyesi)
Egg 17: Burgfalke FB 250 Export (luisps)
Egg 18: Brütsch Pfeil (SACO)
Egg 19: Brütsch V2N (luisps)
Egg 20: Brütsch 200 Spatz (barrett)
Egg 21: Super Jet, an attempt by Union Industrielle to sell the France Jet production to Spain (luisps)
Egg 22: France Jet 1100, built by The Lofstrand Company, Rockville, Maryland (luisps)
Egg 23: Brütsch Typ S (SACO)
Egg 24: Brütsch V2 (Tom_I)
Egg 25: Spatz Coupé prototype by BAG (Joao)
Egg 26: Brütsch K 400 (Facel)
Egg 27: Sprint, Swiss licence-built Brütsch Spatz by Max Schaer (luisps)
Egg 28: Spatz 200 Coupé by Spatz Fahrzeugbau Harald Friedrich (Facel)
Egg 29: Brütsch Zwerg II (luisps)
Egg 30: Victoria 250 Cabriolet prototype (pnegyesi)
Egg 31: France Jet, built in 1959 by Union Industrielle in France (sixtee5cuda)
Egg 32: Brütsch Zwerg Zweisitzer (pguillem)
Egg 33: Brütsch 1200 Coupé by Wendler (Joao)
Egg 34: Jet 175, built by Air Tourist (luisps)
Egg 35: Opelit by Georg von Opel (pguillem)
Egg 36: Rollera by Air Tourist (barrett)
Egg 37: Victoria 250 (Tom_I)
Egg 38: Progress Supreme Tourette (luisps)
Egg 39: Brütsch Mopetta 1958 (Tom_I)
Egg 40: Modern Microcars Mopetta (barrett)
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Great puzzle !
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Egg 3: BRüTSCH ZWERG
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Egg 35: 1957 Brütsch Mopetta Roadster
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Egg 3: BRüTSCH ZWERG
The looks are very similar, but this one is not a Brütsch Zwerg. You can try again on this one, but remember that you have wait 24 h from your last egg post for a try on another egg.
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Egg 35: 1957 Brütsch Mopetta Roadster
It is closely related, but this one is not a Brütsch Mopetta. You can try again on this one, but remember that you have wait 24 h from your last egg post for a try on another egg.
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12 Spatz 200?
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Egg 02 : Brütsch Rolletta ?
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Great puzzle great idea! :thumbsup:
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12 Spatz 200?
Yes, but that is only part of the name. There's a little bit more to the story, too.
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Egg 02 : Brütsch Rolletta ?
No, but you are close. As far as I know there never was a Rolletta. It must have been a typo already appearing in a German car magazine in 1957.
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Egg 3 If not Brütsch Zwerg could be one of the first Avolette from Air Tourist.
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Egg 3 If not Brütsch Zwerg could be one of the first Avolette from Air Tourist.
Now you are very close. It is an Avolette from Air Tourist, but the name isn't complete. As you stated correctly, it is one of the first ones. Have a second look.
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I've found in a brochure of 1955the name of "Brütsch-Avolette" from Air Tourist
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I've found in a brochure of 1955 the name of "Brütsch-Avolette" from Air Tourist
I have good news and bad news for you. The good one first: you are right, the first Avolette by Air Tourist went by the name of Brutsch Avolette (notice the missing dots above the u!). The Brutsch Avolette made its first appearance in 1955 at the Paris Salon de l'Automobile. It was powered by a 175 cc Ydral engine and is characterised by its two flared-in headlights. The picture by the way really shows a car with German registration, so it is probably a Zwerg indeed. But I take it as the one it purports to be. We had the Brutsch Avolette before: http://www.autopuzzles.com/forum/index.php?topic=16939.0
The bad news is that you have to wait 24 h from your last post before you can open another egg.
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Egg #20 : Brütsch 300 Mk1 ?
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Egg #20 : Brütsch 300 Mk1 ?
I won't answer this. Please read the rules at the beginning of this group puzzle, mekubb. You have to wait 24 hours after a post before you can guess on another car. Your last guess was at 05:17:06 AM today on Egg 02. Right now you just can try to get Egg 02 right or wait.
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Ok sorry, I thought I only had to wait 24 h after I had guessed it right (and no. 2 wasn't completely correct). I will wait now or dig further into no. 2
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I'm sorry to say that Air Tourist has edited a leaflet with the "¨" on Brütsch; it can e seen in a blog hold by Mr. Philippe Devant. I'm not giving the link due to the rules ...
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I'm sorry to say that Air Tourist has edited a leaflet with the "¨" on Brütsch; it can e seen in a blog hold by Mr. Philippe Devant. I'm not giving the link due to the rules ...
Indeed, it can be seen here: http://www.autopuzzles.com/forum/index.php?topic=16939.msg165865#msg165865
So it is a "Brutsch Avolette" as well as a "Brütsch-Avolette" :D
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I've added a few more, so that there are 40 eggs now. I promise not to lay more eggs!
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Egg 31: Display at the 1960 New York Auto Show. Plate on car indicated it was a "France Jet". Closely resembles Brutsch Jet V2N. The "France Jet" was likely built by Ngo or Union Industrielle in 1959.
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Yes, this is the France Jet that was displayed at the 1960 New York Auto Show. More or less a Brütsch V2N with two doors. It was built under licence in France by Union Industrielle, a company led by Vantung Ngo, a Vietnamese living in France. The "N" in V2N stood for Ngo.
Well done, and another 24 hours started ...
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Egg 21: SUPER JET. Very low quality picture in an advertisement appeared in the newspaper La Vanguardia of Barcelona the 2/9/1959 selling the production license of that car. In reality was the FRANCE JET with engine of 280 c.c. the seller was Union Industrielle of Nogent-sur-Marne (France). Supodselly this company was the successor of Air Tourist.
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Yes, an unsuccessful attempt to sell the France Jet licence and the production tools in Spain.
24 hours ticking for you....
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Number 28: Spatz 200 von Spatz Fahrzeugbau Harald Friedrich Traunreut/OBB
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Number 28: Spatz 200 von Spatz Fahrzeugbau Harald Friedrich Traunreut/OBB
Yes, but one (obvious) detail is missing in the description.
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Egg 17: BURFALKE FB 250 EXPORT. Last attempt to prolong the life of the original design of the Brütsch Spatz trying to be exported to USA.
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I'll accept that in spite of the little typo. ;)
It is a Burgfalke FB 250 Export. Burgfalke bought the production tools and spare bodies in 1959 after Victoria had stopped production one year ago. The Burgfalke should have had two doors, but they only completed some spare Victoria bodies. We had the Burgfalke before (with a not very precise description): http://www.autopuzzles.com/forum/index.php?topic=3257.0
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A slightly modified Victoria brochure served as the first Burgfalke brochure, and the Burgfalke emblem:
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Number 28: Spatz 200 von Spatz Fahrzeugbau Harald Friedrich Traunreut/OBB
Yes, but one (obvious) detail is missing in the description.
I hope you mean the word "Coupe"
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Number 28: Spatz 200 von Spatz Fahrzeugbau Harald Friedrich Traunreut/OBB
Yes, but one (obvious) detail is missing in the description.
I hope you mean the word "Coupe"
Yes ;)
The Spatz 200 Coupé was pictured on a brochure published by Spatz Fahrzeugbau Harald Friedrich from Traunreut. That company was founded in 1955, originally to build the Brütsch 200 Spatz under licence. But Friedrich soon discovered that the Brütsch car was a faulty construction, and decided to hire Hans Ledwinka of Tatra fame in order to reconstruct the car. A tubular frame was added to the roadster as well as a fourth wheel. I don't know how many of these roadster-based coupes were built.
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Egg 23: BRÜTSCH T MODELL, first car built by Egon Brütsch with a single seat presented in 1950 with a 175 c.c. engine from NSU latter were installed Bker & Polling 250 c.c. engines.
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Egg 23: BRÜTSCH T MODELL, first car built by Egon Brütsch with a single seat presented in 1950 with a 175 c.c. engine from NSU latter were installed Bker & Polling 250 c.c. engines.
Now that's where things get complicated. You are right that it is the first of the Brütsch microcars (He built racecars and children's cars before). It started with a NSU engine (125 cc I think) and was later on equipped with a Baker & Pölling engine. I found several names applied to this car, but going by reliability of the source I tend to say that this car was not the T, that was a later model of similar layout. I would say that it was called something else, also a one-letter type name.
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Egg 9 BRÜTSCH 200 SPATZ COUPE. prototype unique with a folding roof that swings upwad including the doors. was too heavy for the small engine nd the project was deleted.
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Egg 9 BRÜTSCH 200 SPATZ COUPE. prototype unique with a folding roof that swings upwad including the doors. was too heavy for the small engine nd the project was deleted.
Yes, that's it. It was not a folding roof, but a right-hand folding gullwing door, like at the Trippel SK-10 (http://www.autopuzzles.com/forum/index.php?topic=2769.0).
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Fascinating puzzle :thumbsup:
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Fascinating puzzle :thumbsup:
Thanks! I had my share of fun sorting out all the possible puzzle cars. ;D
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26 is brutsch 400 i think
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26 is brutsch 400 i think
Yes, but one letter missing to describe this body version: Brütsch _ 400. Any idea?
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egg1 - BAG SPATZ?
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egg1 - BAG SPATZ?
Yes, that is the Spatz roadster, presented in 1955 by Spatz Fahrzeugbau Harald Friedrich. In 1956 he joined up with Victoria in order to sell his Spatz through the Victoria dealership. So the Bayrische Autowerke GmbH (BAG) was founded, sometimes also abbreviated as BAW.
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Egg 27: SPRINT failed attempt of Mr. Max Schär to produce the initial Brutsch Spatz threewheeler in Switzerland.
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Very good. That one was new even to me when I gathered the pictures for this puzzle. It is doubtful whether any Sprint were built.
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no, no idea what you mean
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6: Brutsch mopeta
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6: Brutsch mopeta
Correct the typo and the point is yours. ;)
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Egg 22: FRANCE JET 1100 built by Lofstrand in Rockvlle USA in 1961. Based in the original french FRANCE JET presented in 1959 in the New York Auto Show (see Egg 31 already solved) but using an american 4 cylinder from Koler.
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Egg 22: FRANCE JET 1100 built by Lofstrand in Rockvlle USA in 1961. Based in the original french FRANCE JET presented in 1959 in the New York Auto Show (see Egg 31 already solved) but using an american 4 cylinder from Koler.
Yes, this is the American-built France Jet with a 1100 cc Kohler engine, since the original engine was too small for the US market. Just one prototype built.
We had that one before: http://www.autopuzzles.com/forum/index.php?topic=6438.0
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Egg 34 FRANCE JET 175 first of the cars, made by Air Tourist, using that name. Presented in 1958 with an 175 c.c. engine. As any success was achieved by that model, later was developed to larger engines and bodies.
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Egg 34 FRANCE JET 175 first of the cars, made by Air Tourist, using that name. Presented in 1958 with an 175 c.c. engine. As any success was achieved by that model, later was developed to larger engines and bodies.
Yes, right again. The Jet 175 was based on the Brütsch V2N. It was probably a one-off.
This one could be seen here before, too: http://www.autopuzzles.com/forum/index.php?topic=13940.0
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6: Brutsch mopeta
Correct the typo and the point is yours. ;)
Mopetta
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6: Brutsch mopeta
Correct the typo and the point is yours. ;)
Mopetta
Yes, #6 is the Brütsch Mopetta from 1956. Pictured is the Luxusausführung.
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6: Brutsch mopeta
Correct the typo and the point is yours. ;)
Mopetta
Yes, #6 is the Brütsch Mopetta from 1956. Pictured is the Luxusausführung.
And what time I can find a new egg?
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24 hours after your last post
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Egg 19: BRÜTSCH V2-N last attempt of Egon Brütsch to made a microcar in 1958. In the brochure says 250 c.c. Volks-Zweistzer NGO due to the investment of a Indonesian businessman with that name. As you mentioned in the answer to m post of Egg 22 that design was used to develop some France Jet models.
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Egg 19: BRÜTSCH V2-N last attempt of Egon Brütsch to made a microcar in 1958. In the brochure says 250 c.c. Volks-Zweistzer NGO due to the investment of a Indonesian businessman with that name. As you mentioned in the answer to m post of Egg 22 that design was used to develop some France Jet models.
Yes, another point for you.
An interesting detail is the number and type of doors. Below you can see pictures of a Brütsch V2N with one left door opening backwards, the Brütsch V2N rendering with (one or two) doors opening forward like the two-door France Jet, and a Union Industrielle Jet V2N without doors (Bellu shows a picture of the doorless left side).
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26 is brutsch 400 i think
Yes, but one letter missing to describe this body version: Brütsch _ 400. Any idea?
I hope you mean the word Cabrio-Limousine. It was made by Wendler
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26 is brutsch 400 i think
Yes, but one letter missing to describe this body version: Brütsch _ 400. Any idea?
I hope you mean the word Cabrio-Limousine. It was made by Wendler
No, I'm not looking for a word, but a single letter (A, B, C, ...). Combine that with your guess and you are close to the solution. ;)
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I think I could keep luisps and some other experts busy for some weeks, but let's increase the speed and move it to the top.
Pros, please make yourself familiar with the rules of this puzzle.
In order to prevent that some microcar buff like me grabs all points at once, you can only have a guess at one car at a time. After your post you have to wait for 24 hours before you can guess on another car.
As some of these cars are of the "It is either this or that" type, there will be no locks.
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#18 :Brutsch Pfeil ?
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#18 :Brutsch Pfeil ?
Yes, it is the Brütsch Pfeil, predecessor of the V2N.
Here's another picture serving the "People standing on cars" theme:
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#23: NSU Powered 125cc
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#23: NSU Powered 125cc
We had that already established.
Egg 23: BRÜTSCH T MODELL, first car built by Egon Brütsch with a single seat presented in 1950 with a 175 c.c. engine from NSU latter were installed Bker & Polling 250 c.c. engines.
Now that's where things get complicated. You are right that it is the first of the Brütsch microcars (He built racecars and children's cars before). It started with a NSU engine (125 cc I think) and was later on equipped with a Baker & Pölling engine. I found several names applied to this car, but going by reliability of the source I tend to say that this car was not the T, that was a later model of similar layout. I would say that it was called something else, also a one-letter type name.
Now you have 24 hours of time to find the missing letter. ;)
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Sorry, I read just the 1st page with the answers...
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#11 ~ Brütsch Bussard
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#8 - 1953 Brütsch Eremit Cabriolet by Wendler.
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I think Egg 5 is the Brütsch Zwerg Einsitzer, 1955-56, a single-seater Zwerg (dwarf) with a 74 cc engine as used in the DKW Hobby scooter.
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#11 ~ Brütsch Bussard
Yes.
The Brütsch Bussard and its four-wheeled version Brütsch Pfeil can be seen here side by side:
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#8 - 1953 Brütsch Eremit Cabriolet by Wendler.
Yes, this car first went by the name of Typ T, later on as Eremit. It looks similar to the 400, but is a single-seater.
We had it her before: http://www.autopuzzles.com/forum/index.php?topic=14833.0
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I think Egg 5 is the Brütsch Zwerg Einsitzer, 1955-56, a single-seater Zwerg (dwarf) with a 74 cc engine as used in the DKW Hobby scooter.
Correct.
We had the Brütsch Zwerg Einsitzer before, but inprecisely identified as Brütsch Zwerg: http://www.autopuzzles.com/forum/index.php?topic=1565.0
One Zwerg Einsitzer has recently been restored and was shown at Villa d'Este this year.
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Hmm, where to start? ;)
Egg #40 is a 2003 Mopetta built by 'Modern Microcars'
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Hmm, where to start? ;)
Egg #40 is a 2003 Mopetta built by 'Modern Microcars'
Yes, indeed, a modern recreation of the Brütsch Mopetta.
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I changed Egg 33, because it was identical to another one, sorry.
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So many eggs, and it's not Eastern time. Ei, Ei, Ei or, as we say in french : Aïe aïe aïe !
Egg 35 : it's the Opelit, isn't it ?
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Egg 35 : it's the Opelit, isn't it ?
Yes, that's the only surviving Opelit, an attempt by Georg von Opel to build the slightly modified Brütsch Mopetta under licence in 1957 at the Horex factory.
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Egg 38: TOURETTE SUPREME made in UK by Progress-Supreme Co. with a single stroke, single cylinder Villiers engine of 197 c.c.. That car looks to me that is the only one between the 40 eggs listed that doesn't has any relation with Brütsch designs. Looks very similar to the Zwergs or Avolettes but the first Tourettes appeared in 1956 before of the mentioned Brüstch models...
I'm sorry about your decision to upgrade this puzzle to pros, I was prepared to obtain almost 30 points with my answers...
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Egg 38: TOURETTE SUPREME made in UK by Progress-Supreme Co. with a single stroke, single cylinder Villiers engine of 197 c.c.. That car looks to me that is the only one between the 40 eggs listed that doesn't has any relation with Brütsch designs. Looks very similar to the Zwergs or Avolettes but the first Tourettes appeared in 1956 before of the mentioned Brüstch models...
Yes, the Progress Supreme Tourette shares its looks eith the Brütsch cars, but is technically independent from them. It is the false egg in here and was supposed to fool the puzzlers (to no avail). We had it here before: http://www.autopuzzles.com/forum/index.php?topic=16553.0 BTW, the first Brütsch Spatz appeared in 1954.
I'm sorry about your decision to upgrade this puzzle to pros, I was prepared to obtain almost 30 points with my answers...
Shared fun is double fun. ;)
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26 is brutsch 400 i think
Yes, but one letter missing to describe this body version: Brütsch _ 400. Any idea?
I hope you mean the word Cabrio-Limousine. It was made by Wendler
No, I'm not looking for a word, but a single letter (A, B, C, ...). Combine that with your guess and you are close to the solution. ;)
C
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You think in the right direction, but in the wrong language. Think German! ;)
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#23 : Brutsch Eremit 1950 ?
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#23 : Brutsch Eremit 1950 ?
No, I know that some sources call it a Typ T or an Eremit, but I think that the correct designation is another one. For the next 24 hours you can join Paul Jaray in thinking about the missing letter:
#23: NSU Powered 125cc
We had that already established.
Egg 23: BRÜTSCH T MODELL, first car built by Egon Brütsch with a single seat presented in 1950 with a 175 c.c. engine from NSU latter were installed Bker & Polling 250 c.c. engines.
Now that's where things get complicated. You are right that it is the first of the Brütsch microcars (He built racecars and children's cars before). It started with a NSU engine (125 cc I think) and was later on equipped with a Baker & Pölling engine. I found several names applied to this car, but going by reliability of the source I tend to say that this car was not the T, that was a later model of similar layout. I would say that it was called something else, also a one-letter type name.
Now you have 24 hours of time to find the missing letter. ;)
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I can play now ? ;D
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I can play now ? ;D
For the next 24 hours you can place answers only for Egg #23.
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No16: A few Gullwing-top Spatz models were offered by Harald Friedrich. So it is a Bayerische Autowerke Gmbh Spatz Coupe, shown at IFMA 1956
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No16: A few Gullwing-top Spatz models were offered by Harald Friedrich. So it is a Bayerische Autowerke Gmbh Spatz Coupe, shown at IFMA 1956
Correct.
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Egg #23 : Brutsch Touren ?
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Egg #23 : Brutsch Touren ?
No, I'm just looking for a single letter (like Brütsch Typ T)
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Egg #33 -1952-53 Brütsch-Ford 1200 Sport Coupe by Wendler. One-off.
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Egg #23 : Brutsch Typ S ?
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Egg 24: Brütsch V2, 1956-58
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Egg #33 -1952-53 Brütsch-Ford 1200 Sport Coupe by Wendler. One-off.
Yes, this is the Brütsch 1200 Coupé by Wendler. There was another coupe with white plastic body, done by Wacker (Pforzheim), recognizable by its windows behind the doors. The third Brütsch 1200 was a convertible by Wendler. All can be seen here: http://www.autopuzzles.com/forum/index.php?topic=15297.0
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Egg #23 : Brutsch Typ S ?
Yes, that's the name I was after. The S probably stood for Sport-Modell in contrast to T for Touren-Modell.
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Egg #13 is the redesigned Avolette from 1957. This was Lambretta engined and known as the LA 150 (& presumably the LA 125 or LA 175 depending on what cc motor you specified)
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Egg #13 is the redesigned Avolette from 1957. This was Lambretta engined and known as the LA 150 (& presumably the LA 125 or LA 175 depending on what cc motor you specified)
Correct.
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Egg 15 : Brütsch Zwerg Zweisitzer from 1955 ?
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Egg 24: Brütsch V2, 1956-58
Sorry, I missed that one. You are right that this is the Brütsch V2 (Volkszweisitzer), a kind of further minituarized Pfeil. I have it built from 1957 to 1958.
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Egg 15 : Brütsch Zwerg Zweisitzer from 1955 ?
I'll accept that answer, although the 24 hours weren't completely over, but they are now. ;)
Yes, it is the Brütsch Zwerg Zweisitzer with a beautiful acrylic glass hardtop, probably a one-off. It would be interesting to see how it opened (forward, backwards or sideways).
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You think in the right direction, but in the wrong language. Think German! ;)
ok, you mean K (Kabriolet)?
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Is #14 the rejected Böbel/Laupheim prototype?
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Egg 29 BRÜTSCH ZWERG II FROM 1956 only 5 units were made
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You think in the right direction, but in the wrong language. Think German! ;)
ok, you mean K (Kabriolet)?
Yes, Egg 26 is the Brütsch K 400, bodied by Wendler. We had it before: http://www.autopuzzles.com/forum/index.php?topic=18382.0#top
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Is #14 the rejected Böbel/Laupheim prototype?
Yes, it is. It had a designation, too. I'm sure you will find it. ;)
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Egg 29 BRÜTSCH ZWERG II FROM 1956 only 5 units were made
Yes, it is the second version of the Zwerg without flared headlights.
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Is #14 the rejected Böbel/Laupheim prototype?
Yes, it is. It had a designation, too. I'm sure you will find it. ;)
I only could find that it was based on a bigger chassis and on a 300 cc engine. Brütsch 300, then?
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Is #14 the rejected Böbel/Laupheim prototype?
Yes, it is. It had a designation, too. I'm sure you will find it. ;)
I only could find that it was based on a bigger chassis and on a 300 cc engine. Brütsch 300, then?
I am looking for a single letter again (and Mr. Thyssen-... doesn't mention it).
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egg#26: Brutsch Egon ?
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egg#26: Brutsch Egon ?
No, Egg #26 is already solved, and Egon was Brütsch's first name.
No 24 hour lock for this guess ;)
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I think Egg 37 is a Victoria 250, a later development of the four-wheeled Spatz made by the Victoria motorcycle company, with a similar body but with a curved one-piece windscreen, Victoria's own 250 cc engine and an electrically operated gearbox.
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I think Egg 37 is a Victoria 250, a later development of the four-wheeled Spatz made by the Victoria motorcycle company, with a similar body but with a curved one-piece windscreen, Victoria's own 250 cc engine and an electrically operated gearbox.
Yes, Victoria took over the BAG Spatz production and modified the Spatz by enlarging the engine to 250 cc and altering the body.
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#25 - 1956 Brütsch 200 Spatz Hardtop Prototype.
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I think No4 is a Victoria 250 roadster prototype
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Egg #36 is the French version of the Rollera, which I think was built by Société Air Tourist as per the Avolette
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Is #14 the rejected Böbel/Laupheim prototype?
Yes, it is. It had a designation, too. I'm sure you will find it. ;)
I only could find that it was based on a bigger chassis and on a 300 cc engine. Brütsch 300, then?
I am looking for a single letter again (and Mr. Thyssen-... doesn't mention it).
Modell 'T'
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#25 - 1956 Brütsch 200 Spatz Hardtop Prototype.
Some parts of your answer are correct, some are not.
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I think No4 is a Victoria 250 roadster prototype
Yes, it is a first attempt by Victoria to modify the Spatz.
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Egg #36 is the French version of the Rollera, which I think was built by Société Air Tourist as per the Avolette
Yes.
We had that before, too: http://www.autopuzzles.com/forum/index.php?topic=16382.0
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#25 - 1956 Brütsch 200 Spatz Hardtop Prototype.
Some parts of your answer are correct, some are not.
1955 Brütsch 200 Spatz Coupe?
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Is #14 the rejected Böbel/Laupheim prototype?
Yes, it is. It had a designation, too. I'm sure you will find it. ;)
I only could find that it was based on a bigger chassis and on a 300 cc engine. Brütsch 300, then?
I am looking for a single letter again (and Mr. Thyssen-... doesn't mention it).
Modell 'T'
No
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#25 - 1956 Brütsch 200 Spatz Hardtop Prototype.
Some parts of your answer are correct, some are not.
1955 Brütsch 200 Spatz Coupe?
Some parts of your answer are correct, some are not.
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Egg 10 BELCAR swiss version of the first BRÜTSCH SPATZ threewheeler. That picture appears in a brochure of the builder (A.Grünhut & Co.) without mention to a special name to this model with doors.
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1956 Spatz 200 Coupe by BAG?
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Egg 10 BELCAR swiss version of the first BRÜTSCH SPATZ threewheeler. That picture appears in a brochure of the builder (A.Grünhut & Co.) without mention to a special name to this model with doors.
Correct again. It is the second Belcar version with doors and a 230 cc engine. The doorless first version had a 200 cc engine.
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1956 Spatz 200 Coupe by BAG?
Yes ;D
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Egg 02 : Brütsch Rollera from 1956 ?
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(and Mr. Thyssen-... doesn't mention it).
Rosellen doesn't either...
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Egg 02 : Brütsch Rollera from 1956 ?
Correct.
The third picture below shows a later version.
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(and Mr. Thyssen-... doesn't mention it).
Rosellen doesn't either...
No wonder, as Rosellen and Thyssen-Bornemissza are one and the same person. ;D
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No wonder, as Rosellen and Thyssen-Bornemissza are one and the same person. ;D
:doh:
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Egg#7 : Avolette by Cessna France ?
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Egg#7 : Avolette by Cessna France ?
The French Cessna distributor was Air Tourist. So you are right that this is the 1956 Avolette version that came between the Brütsch-Avolette (Egg #3) and the revised 1957 Avolette (Egg #13). There was a beautiful hardtop available for this one:
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Egg 39: The Amphibious Brütsch Mopetta (allegedly).
I don't know how much truth there is in it, but I have read that Egon Brütsch claimed that the Mopetta would be naturally buoyant, and he had ideas of marketing it as a boat, as well as a car. In all this he was ignoring the fact that the body was not not actually watertight, and that the air-cooled engine would have filled up with water if the body tub was not radically redesigned.
But undeterred by trivial details, he arranged for publicity photos to be taken of a Mopetta prototype, presumably without engine, and quite likely without wheels, made to look as if it was being piloted along a stream by a young lady.
Unfortunately the photo is not entirely convincing. Judging by the stones and twigs sticking out of the water, it can't be more than a few centimetres deep, and from the ripples radiating from the Mopetta, it is obviously not moving, but is standing still on the bottom. The 'driver' has just rocked it a few times to stir up the surface of the water.
Nice idea, though, and I wish I'd been there to see the photo shoot! ;D
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Egg 39: The Amphibious Brütsch Mopetta (allegedly).
That's a nice story and Brütsch really advertised the Mopetta as a car for road and water, as can be seen on the attached ad. Egg 39 is a Brütsch Mopetta, but what is the difference to the Mopetta from Egg 6 (or the Mopetta below)?
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#30 - Felber-Victoria?
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No30: A Victoria 250 cabriolet prototype with side doors
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#30 - Felber-Victoria?
No. I don't know of a connection between Victoria and Felber.
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No30: A Victoria 250 cabriolet prototype with side doors
Yes, that's it.
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#30 - Felber-Victoria?
No. I don't know of a connection between Victoria and Felber.
A picture :
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Egg 39 is a Brütsch Mopetta, but what is the difference to the Mopetta from Egg 6 (or the Mopetta below)?
Well, I've learned something today. I can see the obvious differences between the two Mopettas, but didn't realise the fundamental one. This is partly down to a book I have been referring to which has a chapter on Brütsch. I can take some small comfort in that the book's author doesn't know the difference between the two Mopetta models either.
The book reproduces the same picture as Egg 6, with the caption "...Also of note is the absence of any evidence of engines on the left hand side, indicating a right-hand position for the engines on these cars".
But that's obviously wrong, as the German advert posted in Reply #136 clearly says "Direct drive to the front wheel".
So the 1956 Mopetta has the engine at the front, presumably turning with the front wheel. So Egg 39, with the different frontal design, must be a later model (1958?), with the more familiar engine mounted on the left hand side, driving the left rear wheel by a chain.
Interesting that the front-engined Mopetta was actually advertised as for road and water, but it makes it even stranger to show the later model in water. Not only would the engine have been flooded, but the whole thing would probably capsize in deep water, with the weight of the engine being on one side.
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#30 - Felber-Victoria?
No. I don't know of a connection between Victoria and Felber.
A picture :
:thumbsup:
You learn something new everyday on AutoPuzzles! ;D
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Egg 39 is a Brütsch Mopetta, but what is the difference to the Mopetta from Egg 6 (or the Mopetta below)?
Well, I've learned something today. I can see the obvious differences between the two Mopettas, but didn't realise the fundamental one. This is partly down to a book I have been referring to which has a chapter on Brütsch. I can take some small comfort in that the book's author doesn't know the difference between the two Mopetta models either.
The book reproduces the same picture as Egg 6, with the caption "...Also of note is the absence of any evidence of engines on the left hand side, indicating a right-hand position for the engines on these cars".
But that's obviously wrong, as the German advert posted in Reply #136 clearly says "Direct drive to the front wheel".
So the 1956 Mopetta has the engine at the front, presumably turning with the front wheel. So Egg 39, with the different frontal design, must be a later model (1958?), with the more familiar engine mounted on the left hand side, driving the left rear wheel by a chain.
Interesting that the front-engined Mopetta was actually advertised as for road and water, but it makes it even stranger to show the later model in water. Not only would the engine have been flooded, but the whole thing would probably capsize in deep water, with the weight of the engine being on one side.
That's what I call a perfect answer. I didn't notice the difference between the original Mopetta and the Mopetta 1958 before I created this puzzle. I just stumbled over the different grill, and then I had a closer look...
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What's left?
I think Egg#20 is the Bruetsch 300 Mk1 by Bruetsch cars England although there is little to differentiate it from the 'normal' German Brütsch Spatz
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What's left?
I think Egg#20 is the Bruetsch 300 Mk1 by Bruetsch cars England although there is little to differentiate it from the 'normal' German Brütsch Spatz
Sometimes it is more simple than you think. This picture was used in the British brochure of the Brütsch 300 Mk.1 as well, but it you can't differentiate it from the Brütsch Spatz, because the picture just shows a Brütsch Spatz.
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Egg 12 BRÜTSCH SPATZ 200 of 1954
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In reference to the FELBER-VICTORIA the picture shown was token by myself together with others with the full car. It happened in the "XIII Trobada Internacional de Microctches de Manresa" the 28/5/2011. Talking with the owner of the car he confirmed that these car was made in Germany but the distributor of Victoria in Austria at that time was Felber and the only difference is the additional Felber logo. You can see the rest of pictures in the best web about the car history that you can see in Spanish...
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Egg 12 BRÜTSCH SPATZ 200 of 1954
Yes. Just to complete it, please tell the difference to Egg #20.
And thank you for the additional info on the Felber Victoria 250, very much appreciated.
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Egg 32 : Brütsch Zwerg Zweisitzer ?
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Egg 32 : Brütsch Zwerg Zweisitzer ?
Yes, this time without hardtop.
Why do people like to stand on cars ???
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Egg 32 : Brütsch Zwerg Zweisitzer ?
Yes, this time without hardtop.
Why do people like to stand on cars ???
That was the beginning of car-surfing, ant it was much less dangerous than today with these eggs.
NB Note the holes in the body of the car for securing the feet
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The difference between the Spatz of Egg 12 and the one in Egg 20 is one year as the last one is from 1955 and the first is from 1954. Also the prospect refers to an Export version that includes a different windscreen with a full metal trim, screen wiper and side spot lights. Curiously such prospect doesn't mentions the name Spatz, instead says " dreirad-dreisitzer" (3 wheels-3 seats)
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The difference between the Spatz of Egg 12 and the one in Egg 20 is one year as the last one is from 1955 and the first is from 1954. Also the prospect refers to an Export version that includes a different windscreen with a full metal trim, screen wiper and side spot lights. Curiously such prospect doesn't mentions the name Spatz, instead says " dreirad-dreisitzer" (3 wheels-3 seats)
Correct. I guess the 1954 Spatz was the prototype, the other one was the "production" version.
I think the omission of the Spatz name in 1955 had to do with the beginning of the Spatz production by Friedrich, as well as the lawsuit between Friedrich and Brütsch.
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Now we only need one letter in the name of the Böbel-built coupe and this puzzle is finished.
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If I'm not confused it's titled R-400 (Rolldach Coupé) on one page..
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If I'm not confused it's titled R-400 (Rolldach Coupé) on one page..
:applause: Well found.
I hereby declare this puzzle solved. I hope you had as much fun cruising through the ovoid Brütsch universe as I had compiling facts and pictures for this puzzle. Points will be awarded soon.
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It was a very nice puzzle, thank you
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Although I didn't take part in the puzzle (it's not really my area of expertise) but I appreciate the hard work that has gone into it's creation. Well done Wendax. :thumbsup:
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In the case of Egg 23 you mention a reliable source to reject the Modell T name as appears in Thyssen's web. Could you please mention that source? I can confirm that Thyssen's web is full of mistakes, but been German I haven't expected these errors on Brütsch cars.
What it's completely true is that not a single one of the Spanish microcars in such web has true description, furthermore there are pictures that doesn't corresponds to the brands were are placed...Unfortunately the history of microcars becomes a complete mess due to these neglected sources.
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Great puzzle Wendax :thumbsup:
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Great puzzle for sure ! :thumbsup:
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Up, up and away...
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In the case of Egg 23 you mention a reliable source to reject the Modell T name as appears in Thyssen's web. Could you please mention that source? I can confirm that Thyssen's web is full of mistakes, but been German I haven't expected these errors on Brütsch cars.
What it's completely true is that not a single one of the Spanish microcars in such web has true description, furthermore there are pictures that doesn't corresponds to the brands were are placed...Unfortunately the history of microcars becomes a complete mess due to these neglected sources.
PM sent
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Thank you all for the flowers!
The final score:
luisps: 12 points :applause:
barrett: 4 points
pguillem: 4 points
Tom_I: 4 points
Facel: 3 points
Joao: 3 points
pnegyesi: 3 points
SACO: 3 points
Allemano: 2 points
Julien1A: 1 point
sixtee5cuda: 1 point
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Great puzzle! :)
Strange the big difference between Thyssen's website and his standard book on German microcars (under a different name, though) which appears quite reliable.
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Thyssen /Rosellen did an unvaluable job when gathering information about German postwar microcars and putting them in his book, but when it gets to details you can sometimes notice his boulevard journalism background, especially in his later "Europäische Kleinwagen" books.
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(...) especially in his later "Europäische Kleinwagen" books.
Quite! These are downright ridiculously wrong in many examples.
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Thanks for this puzzle. Er ist super. :)
I can now update my archives with a few cars.Filling the gaps in my knowledge.
Wouldnt it be nice to have an article describing all these eggsa bit more because some are very obscure.
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If I find the time, may be, but I can't promise.
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A contemporary 1951 magazine clipping:
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:thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup:
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Here´s a 1951 Brütsch Jugendrennwagen (racing car for the youth).
I think we had it before as the Type S chassis:
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:thumbsup:
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An addition to egg #12:
A 10/1954 Brütsch 200 Spatz prototype test:
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and a second paper clipping, which calls egg #12 "Dreiradwagen K 200":
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The Swiss Belcar project made its way to the Netherlands and evolved there in the Citeria. The only one made still exists.
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The Swiss Belcar project made its way to the Netherlands and evolved there in the Citeria. The only one made still exists.
The existant Citeria (http://www.autopuzzles.com/forum/index.php?topic=7822.0) has nothing in common with Brütsch's eggs, though.
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Just to add another variation of the theme: a Victoria 250 with a windscreen I haven't seen so far:
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A nice period shot of a Spatz:
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A Victoria 250 with extra non-stock bumpers:
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A Spatz with gullwing hardtop, displayed on a Victoria stand, but still labelled as Spatz:
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A Brütsch K 400, a Brütsch 200 and a Brütsch 1200 Coupé altogether: