SOLVED: Djetset #639 - Pilgrim Rapier (Hawthorn prototype)

Carnut · May 17, 2013, 05:16:28 AM

Pilgrim?

Djetset · May 17, 2013, 08:12:27 AM

Ah, now we're getting somewhere! It is a Pilgrim, so now locked to you for the correct model name.

Carnut · May 17, 2013, 08:41:55 AM

Quote from: Djetset on May 17, 2013, 08:12:27 AM
Ah, now we're getting somewhere! It is a Pilgrim, so now locked to you for the correct model name.

Looks like a Pilgrim Hawthorn.
Perhaps it's an early prototype for it?

Djetset · May 17, 2013, 09:08:09 AM

It is an early Pilgrim Hawthorn prototype, which means that it has a different model name, so remains locked t you.

Carnut · May 17, 2013, 10:26:27 AM

Quote from: Djetset on May 17, 2013, 09:08:09 AM
It is an early Pilgrim Hawthorn prototype, which means that it has a different model name, so remains locked t you.

Hmmm..

Well, Pilgrim originally wanted to call this model Phantom, but Rolls-Royce were not impressed..
So they changed their ideas to Swift, whereupon Suzuki took exception!
So they settled on the name Hawthorn, but in fact all models made (10 Mk1 and 90 Mk IIs) AND the original prototype were all named Hawthorn! No prototype was made using any other name; this I have on the very top authority!

Djetset · May 17, 2013, 10:31:11 AM

Sorry Carnut, all mostly true, but the first examples did go by another name (that you've not listed) and I have the evidence next to my laptop! So, still locked to you...

Carnut · May 17, 2013, 10:43:07 AM

Quote from: Djetset on May 17, 2013, 10:31:11 AM
Sorry Carnut, all mostly true, but the first examples did go by another name (that you've not listed) and I have the evidence next to my laptop! So, still locked to you...

Noted, but that info may not be right!
I actually spoke to Den Tanner who was the owner of Pilgrim and designed the cars.
It was he who told me 100 cars were made in addition to the prototype, the Mk Is and IIs I listed earlier.
He said that your information can't be right as no other name was used!
He was insistent that all cars made, including the prototype, were named the Hawthorn.
You can ring him yourself to check if you like, I can PM you his phone number!

Djetset · May 17, 2013, 10:57:26 AM

PM sent, but I do have a brochure with its original name, which I will scan in once solved ;)

Carnut · May 17, 2013, 12:40:12 PM

Quote from: Djetset on May 17, 2013, 10:57:26 AM
PM sent, but I do have a brochure with its original name, which I will scan in once solved ;)

OK, but I took it up once more.
Mr Tanner says the picture in your puzzle is of the plug for the Hawthorn. No other name, so I don't think I'm going to be able to find one.

Carnut · May 17, 2013, 01:15:37 PM

Mr Tanner didn't really want to answer any more questions, but I believe I've come up with a name that I think is associated with this car: Rapier?

Djetset · May 17, 2013, 01:33:52 PM

Ah ha, Rapier is it. Another point to you, and a scan of the Pilgrim Rapier brochure to follow. Watch the British motoring press for more news of Mr Tanner very soon, as he will not be involved with cars for a while! :D

Here's a poor-quality image of the Pilgrim Rapier brochure.

Carnut · May 22, 2013, 02:14:13 PM

Thanks for that. Very interesting.

I sent Den Tanner a copy of your picture and asked him about the background to the name and he replied as follows:

"As I said, the picture shows the plug (made from literally a ton of body filler).

Like an unborn baby in the womb, its parents discussed various names for it as it was developing. I'd forgotten that Rapier was even in the frame at one (very early) stage.

By the time the body mould was made the vehicle was named Hawthorn."

So there you have it from the horse's mouth so to speak!

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SOLVED: Djetset #639 - Pilgrim Rapier (Hawthorn prototype)