Fiat 124 & 125 wanted!

[thorax]

the green prototype above is a Fso not a Fiat 

[75america]

Utility cars

Fissore - 125 station-wagon, ambulance and hearse

Did Fissore made 2 different 125 'Familiare' cars?

[thorax]

[als15]

Did Fissore made 2 different 125 'Familiare' cars?

Yes, I think so: the shortest one was unveiled at 1967 Turin Show and I also have a couple of photos spotted in Geneva (I believe 1968).
Then I've 2 photos of the longest one in Turin and I believe it being the 1968 edition.
In fact, all are regular 125 (not Special), so they are supposed to be converted before Turin 1968, when the 125 Special was launched.

[75america]

Did Fissore made 2 different 125 'Familiare' cars?

Yes, I think so: the shortest one was unveiled at 1967 Turin Show and I also have a couple of photos spotted in Geneva (I believe 1968).
Then I've 2 photos of the longest one in Turin and I believe it being the 1968 edition.
In fact, all are regular 125 (not Special), so they are supposed to be converted before Turin 1968, when the 125 Special was launched.

Are you sure it is not the opposite way around?
The long one (the lower picture in my reply #176) Turin '67 and the short one (the upper picture in my reply #176) Turin '68?
(See 4R issue #143 p177 and #156 p114)

[del78]

do You know this one?

[als15]

Are you sure it is not the opposite way around?
The long one (the lower picture in my reply #176) Turin '67 and the short one (the upper picture in my reply #176) Turin '68?
(See 4R issue #143 p177 and #156 p114)

Double-checked: you are right! Many thanks to have avoided me making this mistake. 

__________________________________________________________________________________-

do You know this one?

Never seen! 
The 500 in background would suggests Italian. Do you know anything more about this odd 124?

[del78]

it is not 124 but Fiat 125p from PL
this photo was taken at some racing event in Poland in eighties
this is homemade racing car
more details is possible but I have to find some old magazine

[als15]

I should be very tired...  I confused a 126 with a 500 and a 125p with a 124...  Hard to say again I'm a Fiat specialist... 

However, any possible additional information is welcome!

[faksta]

There have been numerous similar prototypes built from 124 and 125 Fiats and their derivates in Eastern Europe in eighties, but I know almost nothing about them. They were used mostly in hillclimbs, as far as I can judge. I'll try to find some of them.

By the way, have we mentioned Sappo-Lada from GDR - ZAZ 968 with 1.5 Lada engine in the middle?

[del78]

I should be very tired...  I confused a 126 with a 500 and a 125p with a 124...  Hard to say again I'm a Fiat specialist... 

However, any possible additional information is welcome!

i will try to dig something out

[als15]

By the way, have we mentioned Sappo-Lada from GDR - ZAZ 968 with 1.5 Lada engine in the middle?

Yes, but the problem is that I list cars in my books by manufacturer name. And I've not been able to understand who made the Sappo-Lada. As you of course know, in this case "Sappo" is not the car-maker, but the nickname of Zaporozhets...

[faksta]

Wolfgang Kuether built it, as far as I know. The one who has built Melkus based F.Easter.

[als15]

Wolfgang Kuether built it, as far as I know. The one who has built Melkus based F.Easter.

Great! One more!

[faksta]

I don't remember whether I have told you about Lada rally cars before, those made by VFTS/EVA, VIHUR, LSGA and MTX at least. Also, 1986 Tavria ERF-Mobile - Gr.B prototype with VAZ 2106 engine. Also NAMI 0290 Apelsin. Pics of these later.

Poch from France have also entered a Lada in Dakar rally (at least that car carried Poch ads on its body). 1983 - Jacques Potherat / Marc Billoret. The car has been modified a little, major upgrade being seemingly rollcage.

[faksta]

One of the most mysterious cars for me among those which were mentioned already. Took part in 1987 Dakar rally (Lacroix - Soalhat driver lineup). Retired during the first stage. Probably related to Poch as well, I just don't know.

[faksta]

Hungarian Volan has made some cars. I've heard of quite usual rally Ladas, VFTS-like, from them, as well as of some 'Lada Turbo' raced at hillclimbs and seen a picture of a seemingly mid-engined 2101 for hillclimbing... The problem is that Volan, as far as I'm aware, was a group of factories, so it is hard for me to establish which exact factory was responsible for one car or another.

[faksta]

VIHUR from USSR (current Estonia)

There have apparently been two versions of VIHUR prepared 2101 and a 2105. The latter seems very 'production' on photos, don't know what was it like in terms of technics. Here's a picture of the first version of 2101.

Notably, VIHUR was also building racing motorcycles.

[faksta]

This one is a blank spot. All I know is that it is a hillclimb car from Bulgaria.

[als15]

I don't remember whether I have told you about Lada rally cars before, those made by VFTS/EVA, VIHUR, LSGA and MTX at least. Also, 1986 Tavria ERF-Mobile - Gr.B prototype with VAZ 2106 engine. Also NAMI 0290 Apelsin. Pics of these later.

Poch from France have also entered a Lada in Dakar rally (at least that car carried Poch ads on its body). 1983 - Jacques Potherat / Marc Billoret. The car has been modified a little, major upgrade being seemingly rollcage.

We spoke a little about these cars. I got some info about VFTS, MTX and NAMI.
On the other hand, I didn't know VIHUR and Volan (thanks for the pictures) and still I've no info about LSGA and Tavria.

[faksta]

LSGA (Laboratory for Sports and Racing Cars) is probably only partly fitting, as it was a VAZ child. Can't say it was a VAZ sports department, as there is only one car that is mentioned in relation to LSGA I could find - Lada 2105 LSGA, while before and after there were other cars by VAZ related enterprises (VAZ structure is really a complete mess for me). It was a 2105 with 2-door body, McPhersons in both front and rear, 16-valve 1730cc engine (highly modified 2106 unit) capable of 150hp, built around 1984. Info is scarce, photos - even more. Have not survived.

Tavria ERF-Mobile was a rally prototype built around tube frame and VAZ 2106 engine with ZAZ Tavria-ish body. It was designed in current Estonia in 1986 at sports & technical club of ERF (Estreklamfilm - at work those guys produced TV ads and so on...) by the club's director - Kalle Keel of TARK (Estonia formulae) fame. It was a common practice in USSR that factories and various collectives had their sports sections (in everyday life many Soviet racing drivers drove taxis, ambulances, even army trucks), so no wonder that movie making guys have eventually come up with a car 2106 engine of 1568cc, 140hp, behind the driver. Independent suspension, weight around 800kg.
I've also seen a picture of ERF rally team with three 2101 Ladas (those were hardly of their own preparation).
ERF-Mobile was said to be seen at some auto show in Tartu in 2002 and is probaby in private collection now (no proof).

[Paul Jaray]

Not the right place, I know, but I wonder if you knew of this:

[thorax]

great !

[als15]

Not the right place, I know, but I wonder if you knew of this:

great !

Definitely!
In a mid-term plan, we are also going to publish a revised edition of my old "Fiat Topolino fuoriserie". This is a great start to update it!

[Paul Jaray]

That's a good news.
Here's the article and another Maier's creation